"From little things big things grow" and Covid

Discussion in 'Off Topic [DB]' started by David Potts, Jul 23, 2021.

  1. We all knew it was coming but it only took one outsourced, unprotected unvaccinated driver to pass the highly contagious Covid Delta variant into the community from an overseas airline crew that he was transporting into quarantine. The result is now, after a month of trying to stop its spread, more than half of of us in Australia are again suffering some form of lockdown and numbers of community sourced infections are rising. In New South Wales, the hardest hit state where I live, most infections are currently in the southern and south-western areas of Sydney where there is the greatest concentrations of lower paid workers and recent arrivals. Culturally these often have large closely knit families that may not speak much English or understand what is going on

    Our Federal Government has been responsible for handling the Covid pandemic from its very beginnings up until now however it has been so inept that it "couldn't even organise a chook raffle". Each of our sovereign states has been doing its best to handle successive waves of infection. Roll-out of the Astro Zenica vaccine has been dreadfully slow, with supply problems and failure to deliver a workable plan. There was a scare about blood clots that stopped things dead when in reality one person has died after over 12 million doses were injected. People have been hanging back, waiting for Pfizer which is now starting to arrive in sizeable amounts but we are woefully under-vaccinated compared to you guys in America. Hence the worry that contact tracing that follows reported infections will be overwhelmed and the Delta strain gets away expotentially.

    What does this mean to me, a 79yo almost fully retired orchestral bass player and bass teacher? No playing or teaching for quite a while as predictions for getting control of the Covid numbers give no end in site. Will return to "normal" ever be possible in my remaining years of playing the bass in orchestras or driving a car? Overseas travel is highly unlikely. We have become virtually a cashless society, with a single $5 note in my wallet for months now.

    With so many people required to work from home in the current lock down one good thing is that there is no problem parking in my inner city area !!

    Cheers everyone, get vaccinated and stay safe.


    Incidently "From Little Things Big Things Grow" is a lovely song written by Kev Carmody, a great indigenous Australian, worth checking out IMO.
    Cecilia, JRA, garrett2 and 3 others like this.
  2. Tom Lane

    Tom Lane Gold Supporting Member

    Thanks for the first-person perspective David. Best of luck to you. Here in the States, I rarely drive anymore by having my groceries delivered which allows me to better quarantine.
    Cecilia and Chris Fitzgerald like this.
  3. bherman

    bherman Supporting Member

    Apr 30, 2009
    Grand Junction, CO
    Thanks for the view from "down under". Future generations will look back at this time and wonder how so many countries bungled it so badly, for so many different reasons. Our situation in the USA is somewhat similar, but for completely different reasons. We have an overabundance of available vaccine doses, yet in many states a significant # of residents have refused to get them, for a myriad of reasons (mostly boneheaded). I could literally leave my house and find probably a dozen places to get vaccinated on the spot - for free - within 5 miles of my house. To give you an idea of how variable it is, my state (Colorado) has an overall vaccination rate of over 70%, yet the county that I live in is barely over 40%. So far our lives are mostly back to normal - hardly any restrictions, no mask requirements, few capacity limits, etc- but that will likely change if things don't improve. Its so very frustrating. Thankfully its summer and my band has plenty of gigs - all outdoors at breweries and the like.
    Keith Rawlings, JRA and BobDeRosa like this.
  4. dhergert

    dhergert Gold Supporting Member

    Jan 17, 2018
    Blue Zone, California
    Yup... And unlike down under, the federal government here doesn't manage the lock-down levels, each state, and in fact in many places, each county does. So for example, if I drive 70 miles to L.A., I have to wear masks indoors even though I've been shot, while in my own county -- geographically the largest county in the USA -- I'm free to do whatever I wish.

    I live in a largely medical professional community were there is pretty active support for vaccines, yet my neurologist (I'm a GBS/CIDP survivor) discourages any of her patients from getting any Covid19 vaccine because she's seen a number of her patients have bad -- worse than allergic -- reactions. So not even all the medical community agrees...

    Because of her recommendation I almost didn't get the vaccine myself, but decided to when I realized how seriously concerned my vaccinated family was about passing the virus on to me. I mitigated the risk -- in my mind -- by going with the single-shot and single-exposure J&J vaccine instead of Pfizer or Moderna, but honestly nobody knows how any of these vaccines are going to be viewed retrospectively in years to come.

    In a nutshell, there are just too many unknowns about all this stuff. We humans have a very poor record for predicting the future.
    Keith Rawlings and BobDeRosa like this.
  5. I feel for you David. This Delta variant is very scary and it's hard to see a way out of the mess whilst we're in the middle of it. But like all dark times we go though in life, they do eventually pass and you WILL be back on the stage to play again. I hope you stay safe. Good wishes from Adelaide.
    JRA, BobDeRosa and Chris Fitzgerald like this.
  6. Ed S

    Ed S

    Nov 14, 2019
    Good luck to all.

    W/o getting political, it simply never crossed my mind that so many people would refuse to get the vaccination once it became available.

    I have a nephew in St Louis who postponed his wedding last year, and rescheduled it for next month. Just yesterday, I was informed that they postponed it once again, as St L is becoming a new hot spot. (I dunno why they don't just go down to the cthse and have a party later, but it is not my decision.)

    Get vaccinated everyone.
  7. BobDeRosa

    BobDeRosa Supporting Member Commercial User

    May 16, 2012
    Finger Lakes area of New York State
    Owner, Tritone Jazz Fantasy Camps
    This, from last Friday, is far too reminiscent of the kind of post we were seeing a year ago. Just when we thought there might be light at the end of the tunnel. All because of stupid, stupid people.
    Keith Rawlings and JRA like this.
  8. bherman

    bherman Supporting Member

    Apr 30, 2009
    Grand Junction, CO
    Ain't it the truth. We have a high percentage of Covidiots in my region of the state.
  9. james condino

    james condino Spruce dork Supporting Member Commercial User

    Sep 30, 2007
    asheville, nc
  10. lermgalieu

    lermgalieu Supporting Member

    Apr 27, 2000
    Mill Valley, CA
    I assume your neurologist is making these recommendations to those who have or have had neurological conditions. So doesn't necessarily mean she has a different opinion in general than 99.99% of the world physicians other than the loudmouth outliers who seem to get the most coverage on social disinformation media. As for me, I don't agree with the "too many unknowns" statement. Despite those same loudmouths, every one of these vaccines has gone through significant testing, both controlled and in the wild. There's a bunch of people saying "we don't know, we don't know," but....look around you. 99.99% of the people I know are vaxxed. None have had any significant side effects. On the other hand, I know people who have died or almost died from Covid. Lastly, this is not a political issue. It is a public health issue, despite many people and bots with various agendas trying to make it political.
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2021 at 2:57 PM
  11. Gothic


    Apr 13, 2008
    Over here the government is really tightening things down regarding vaccinations. It recently became mandatory for health workes and it seems to be going that way for most professions, really, starting with the food and drinks industry.

    Vaccinations have been going quite well and we've had pretty much all of them available. Pfizer/Biontech, Moderna, Astra Zeneca. They're also about to start a campaign for at home vaccinations. Most people have been vaccinated. About 5+ million have got both doses and another 5 have done the first. We're about what, 13 million total over here? So it's going pretty well, I suppose.

    Still, there is the whole anti-vax movement and in a lot of cases, it's just for ridiculous reasons backed up by taxi science, rumours and far right or far left "journalists" pushing some kind of silly agenda through that whole shebang. As I said, ridiculous.

    As a health worker on the front line since pretty much the beginning (my work is exactly that), I've seen quite a lot of stuff and I'm sincerely hoping for things to go back to normal, although I highly doubt that's gonna be any time soon.

    In any case, prevention is key. Wear a mask, stay away from crowded areas, be responsible.

    I wish for all of you to stay healthy and well through all of this. Cheers!
    james condino and Tom Lane like this.
  12. bherman

    bherman Supporting Member

    Apr 30, 2009
    Grand Junction, CO
    hats off to you for being a front-line worker through all of this. I can only imagine what it must be like to listen to people blather on about their "opinions" vs science.
    lermgalieu and Gothic like this.
  13. dhergert

    dhergert Gold Supporting Member

    Jan 17, 2018
    Blue Zone, California
    Don't get me wrong, I am not against the Covid19 vaccines, and living in a medical community in a medical family, I have no doubt that Covid19 exists. That said, my neurologist specifically recommended against me getting any Covid19 shot, and she also mentioned that she recommends the same for all of her other neuro patients. And make no mistake, there are serious side effects, but they are statistically very rare and these serious side effects seem to be limited to certain groups of people -- and that is where some of the unknowns are at this time. But mostly because my vaccinated family was worried about simply being around me for fear of giving me the virus, I decided to take the risk and get the shot. Happily, all has gone well for me since then. All things considered, I'd recommend that normal healthy people get vaccinated without hesitation, and if a person has any doubt about it, check with their physician.

    Lastly, from just the way it sounds at the surface, I would take issue with your statement that this isn't a political issue, but perhaps we're really both saying the same thing... Politics being what it is, this pandemic definitely is a political issue, and will continue to be so on both sides of any political table that anyone sits on -- all you have to do is read the news in order to see that. That, however, doesn't mean it is not a real health issue -- the statistics and personal losses have demonstrated that it is. And it seems like some form of Covid19 will continue to be a health issue for as long as herd immunity does not occur.
  14. lermgalieu

    lermgalieu Supporting Member

    Apr 27, 2000
    Mill Valley, CA
    1) I think you are confirming my point on your neurologist - she's not saying "people shouldn't get a vaccine," she's saying "neuro patients shouldn't get the vaccine." Yes, there are serious side effects in very low numbers, and I am assuming she (being an expert) thinks those percentages go up to an unacceptable level for neuro patients. I've got no truck with that. I personally feel there's been a rush with children as well; as a parent who has heart problems in the family, the myocarditis cases definitely concern me, especially with no FDA approval. One of my kids is old enough for vax, and I don't feel comfortable with it (though I am vaxxed).

    2) Re: politics, apologies, I think we are saying the same thing. I was being imprecise. My point was that objectively, a vaccine is not, or rather should not be, a political football. But the political climate in this country, and as influenced by outside actors, has made it into one.

    On the one hand, none of this is new, but on the other hand it feels like everything is at a new level, and it concerns me for the very fundamentals of this country, including our willingness to participate in things that are good for everyone, not just ourselves.
    dhergert likes this.
  15. dhergert

    dhergert Gold Supporting Member

    Jan 17, 2018
    Blue Zone, California
    ^^ We need a "REALLY LIKE" button. Thanks!

    P.S. And, it's really a global health / herd immunity issue. As long as any country has not achieved herd immunity, there will continue to be a Covid19 risk to every country.
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2021 at 5:27 PM
    bherman likes this.
  16. bherman

    bherman Supporting Member

    Apr 30, 2009
    Grand Junction, CO
    Agree on the like ++ button! The unfortunate reality is that nowadays in the US, anything has the potential to become a political football. This certainly should not be one. The ironic thing is that those who kneel at the altar of the big lie somehow don't seem to have grasped that their fearless "former" leader and his entire family have been vaccinated for months.
  17. Wambemando


    Apr 26, 2020
  18. dhergert, a comment on your earliest post here. "The future hasn't happened yet."

    Since I started this thread Sydney has seen growing numbers of daily cases spread over a wider area, now over 200 cases per day but with many unconnected cases in the community. The risk is that the tracers who are doing a great job desperately trying to link cases are going to be overwhelmed as the infection rate climbs, putting more and more pressure on the health systems. The lock-down now affects the whole of Sydney (about 5 million of us) urging everybody to stay and work at home unless absolutely necessary. In the eight worst affected Local Government Areas everyone must wear masks everywhere outside their homes or be fined. Tradesmen and construction workers have been shut down as well the "usual" affected in the food, hospitality and entertainment industries. The list of affected people goes on and on.......... This has been the way that each of our States has managed to bring the number of cases down in the past and allow everyone to relax a little. And yet, last weekend there were protests by thousands of unprotected people not socially distancing about the restrictions' affects on their livelihoods! Of course there is enormous damage happening to our economy from top to bottom, and many businesses and their jobs will not survive. The Federal and State Governments are partly helping businesses and individuals survive financially but many people, eg sole traders and retirees, fall outside the criteria.

    At least the numbers of people tested has jumped, as has the number of people having their first Astro Zeneca jabs but we are still woefully short of the 80% fully vaccinated for herd immunity. Only 1.5 million total jabs and of these about 1/3rd were second jabs. The damage to the brand by the threat of blood clots earlier this year better is understood and is gradually being repaired, and the risk of dying appears to be very low (one in one million?). A limited amount of Pfizer is available and reserved for certain groups. Many people have been holding off, waiting for Pzizer.

    What a mess !! The only relief has been coverage of the Olympic Games where I am now in World Class as a Couch Potato 1st Class.
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2021 at 10:00 PM
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